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Console reverse port coming?

Location PNWPosts: 223 Amazing

Damn...... it isn't looking good for us, is it? Glad I didn't invest thousands like others did. This is disgraceful

Posts: 4,034 Cosmic

@Tumedus said:

@LordInfernus said:

@infinitygirl said:
What I don't get is everything that most of us have been asking for, for years is going into console when these ideas where being asked for the PC version. It just seems extremely bad that they're not doing any of this for PC first since we where the first here. PC is totally getting shafted for Console.

Glorified Beta Testers. That's all we've ever been. It's disgusting that things we've asked for since launch are now in console version and we still sit her in the land of silence about anything new for the PC.

What is astounding to me is that either 1) they aren't bringing some of those things to PC even though people have asked for them forever (e.g. sort), which is just a serious kick in the groin or 2) if they are, they didn't even bother to suggest they were working on those features.

Regarding 2, prior to the console announcement, discussion of those features would be things that I think people would have gotten excited about. Personally, the "costume closet" and sortable roster are things that I would have enjoyed more than just about everything in the BUE (minus the hero updates that ended up good). They teased consideration of a costume closet, which people were genuinely interested in, but no details were ever discussed or any indication any real work was being done on it.

Additionally, suggesting that these features would be coming to PC because of the work the on the console could be a massive PR boon, making the PC players feel better about the benefits a console port is bringing to them.

But nope, silence. Whether its the first one, which seems somewhat likely given the costume closet's lack of details, or the second one, either tack does nothing but reinforce the PC players' perception that they have become disposable.

You hit the only features in that console UI I'm interested in. People keep talking about how good it looks, but all I see is a nightmare in managing cooldowns, resources and health. Bars a Trash Panda! useless, no matter how pretty they look. The convey information in the worst possible way. It's like having an old school gas gauge in your car, vs a newer one that gives either estimated miles till empty, or an actual measurement of fuel remaining. People are vastly more like to run out of gas with just the older gauge.

Sortable roster, costume closet, and the quest tracker were the only things I saw that I liked. The transparencies were a nice touch, but that should simply be an opacity slider. Everything was so small or so vague as to be completely useless. Although to be fair, someone mentioned proper buff/debuff timers, but I didn't notice them on first watch, which could just be me not paying enough attention.

Even if I were to play with a controller, I would detest having half(or more) of my cooldowns hidden at any given moment. That was one of the biggest issues with the previous multi-bar set up we had.

Location ChirstchurchPosts: 288 Amazing

@Tzeentch said:
Ignoring the various issues surrounding everything lately... the console version looks pretty good overall.

While it's not all apples:apples, i hope they bring a lot of that console stuff over to the PC version. I'm hoping beyond hope that they are pulling a Michigan J Frog on us and all of sudden things are going to come alive and be awesome for the PC again soon...

What do you all think?

Dont know if you noticed but was pretty laggy between switching menus man

True BelieverLocation IowaPosts: 116 Incredible

@BabylonPaladin said:

@Program said:

@fxds said:

@vekares said:
Just stop spending money and playing for one week! That's all it would take, there is no revenue from the consoles right now. If we unite we can win. We are the customer here!

If only it were that simple. Even if every player who reads the forums followed your suggestion, it wouldn't make a notable difference since the majority of players don't even know the forums exist. Not to mention that even if enough players boycotted for long enough (and I don't think one week would be nearly long enough), I suspect all it would do is the exact opposite of what you're trying to accomplish, cementing the consoles as the sole future of the game in the minds the folks up high enough at Gaz to make such decisions.

In all likelihood the primary reason the console versions are happening is because they're untapped markets. The PC, on the other hand, is probably looking pretty tapped out. The majority of revenue in the free to play business model comes from new players, and after four years it's a pretty good bet that the stream of new players on PC has slowed considerably. How many PC gamers who are even remotely interested in ARPGs and/or Marvel characters haven't yet tried the game? From a business point of view, the more of the remaining PC revenue you cut off, the more a typical executive is just going to see a rapidly declining bottom line. And under the circumstances the most rational business response would be to shift resources even more toward those new, untapped markets.

Please understand I'm not suggesting that PC players should all start playing and spending more. I don't believe Gaz should be rewarded for refusing to give PC customers anything more than a general "we still have lots of plans" platitude. I'm just saying that in this case I don't think voting with your wallet is going to accomplish anything you'll view as positive. Instead it'll only make it more likely the PC version will be abandoned sooner rather than later (assuming that decision hasn't already been made internally).

I think you hit the nail on the head - "PC market is tapped out". They have to expand to continue to grow their revenue. Gaz is a business and a business has one goal - make money. If they don't feel they are making enough money, they have to expand their market/customer base. I would have to believe that they have analytic "master-minds" that can show the console market is more inclined to spend more money on micro transactions than the typical PC player. Especially since most people playing on PC now have what they want and don't intend to spend anymore or close to that threshold. Gaz's biggest and best option to continue to grow revenue is to expand to the only market that is left available, and untapped - the console.

All you have to do is read the user comments on that article from console people. If Gaz thinks this is gonna save the day, they better still have Superman on speed dial.

I don't know if it will "save the day" per say, but it will give them a huge bump in revenue. I bet they get 5-6 figures of revenue just from the founders packs just to get into the PS4 closed beta. And that is the revenue gains Gaz is banking on getting that they wouldn't get if they were still just on PC. This move is just another move to get a huge uptick in profits for another year or two and expand the life of the game another 5+ years before their profits start to show a steady decline. Then they will have to make a sequel or think of something else.

Posts: 12,367 Cosmic
edited April 19

@GazFirefly said:

@Tzeentch said:
Ignoring the various issues surrounding everything lately... the console version looks pretty good overall.

While it's not all apples:apples, i hope they bring a lot of that console stuff over to the PC version. I'm hoping beyond hope that they are pulling a Michigan J Frog on us and all of sudden things are going to come alive and be awesome for the PC again soon...

What do you all think?

Hi! I'm one of the Senior UI Engineers here at Gaz. I've been here a little over a year now. Long time lurker, first time poster. I've been working on a lot of the console UI for a while and am super excited to finally be able to show it to you guys. Glad to see that you guys like it! It's still far from complete, but we're hoping to make it better and better.

You are right that it isn't apples to apples when it comes to console vs PC. In my own personal opinion, I'm not entirely sure we'd ever want to do a full port of everything in our console UI over to PC. Certainly there are a lot of cool things we have in the console UI that would be nice to have on the PC (like highlighting affected powers on a talent). But the PC has its own advantages, like being able to look at your inventory while simultaneously running around and kicking Oh.. My stars and garters!.

That being said, when we first began work on the console UI, one of my early observations was "this looks super cool... you know the PC crowd is gonna want this." I don't know what the roadmap looks like in the months ahead but you can be sure that the PC crowd has not been forgotten on the UI team. We definitely want to bring not only the useful features, but the aesthetic of the console UI to the PC version at some point. I just don't know if it would be a full port or not. Lots to think about here on our end.

Thanks for the info. Just wondering on the development side, what are the core differences and does that affect how difficult it is to implement certain things on PC vs console?

I assume some differences are

  • for console, you only need to cater for one 'spec' or resolution whereas PC needs to handle multiple resolutions

  • PS/Xbox will have certain UI specifics/API you need to adhere to

  • different control schemes so that will affect UI design

OriginalPosts: 2,573 Cosmic

@GazFirefly said:

@Tzeentch said:
Ignoring the various issues surrounding everything lately... the console version looks pretty good overall.

While it's not all apples:apples, i hope they bring a lot of that console stuff over to the PC version. I'm hoping beyond hope that they are pulling a Michigan J Frog on us and all of sudden things are going to come alive and be awesome for the PC again soon...

What do you all think?

Hi! I'm one of the Senior UI Engineers here at Gaz. I've been here a little over a year now. Long time lurker, first time poster. I've been working on a lot of the console UI for a while and am super excited to finally be able to show it to you guys. Glad to see that you guys like it! It's still far from complete, but we're hoping to make it better and better.

You are right that it isn't apples to apples when it comes to console vs PC. In my own personal opinion, I'm not entirely sure we'd ever want to do a full port of everything in our console UI over to PC. Certainly there are a lot of cool things we have in the console UI that would be nice to have on the PC (like highlighting affected powers on a talent). But the PC has its own advantages, like being able to look at your inventory while simultaneously running around and kicking Oh.. My stars and garters!.

That being said, when we first began work on the console UI, one of my early observations was "this looks super cool... you know the PC crowd is gonna want this." I don't know what the roadmap looks like in the months ahead but you can be sure that the PC crowd has not been forgotten on the UI team. We definitely want to bring not only the useful features, but the aesthetic of the console UI to the PC version at some point. I just don't know if it would be a full port or not. Lots to think about here on our end.


"We will listen to and actively change based on feedback." - A Liar
Location When you know, it's already too late. Posts: 840 Amazing

@BabylonPaladin said:
What do I think? I think by then it will be too little too late.

The Titanic had fewer people jumping ship.

BP bro you know you're stuck here just like the rest of us lifers lol. Don't you dare jump ship.

"I've died before..

It was boring, so I stood up."

VOTING: #BISHOP2018 #HYPERION2018 #THESENTRY2018 #APOCALYPSE2018 #FALCON2018 #ANGEL2018

Location Wandering in the eerie streets of Stratholme.Posts: 3,394 Cosmic

@infinitygirl said:
What I don't get is everything that most of us have been asking for, for years is going into console when these ideas where being asked for the PC version. It just seems extremely bad that they're not doing any of this for PC first since we where the first here. PC is totally getting shafted for Console.

Because we could put a man on the moon during the 60's but Gaz can't give us a debuff/buff indicators and a clean U.I without hundreds of trash over our skill bars.

But it seems consoles are the master race after all. Suddenly all or most of the PC problems are gone there. >_>

Posts: 250 Amazing

@Raijinmeister said:

@BoptimusPrime said:
@KomoriMan Is this serious?
image

New platform, new founders.

Its actually available just to buy in the store. They aren't doing an ultimate pack like PC.

Posts: 400 Amazing

sooo.. are we getting the closet, better roster and buff timers or not?

Posts: 12,367 Cosmic

@GazFirefly said:

@vthree said:

Thanks for the info. Just wondering on the development side, what are the core differences and does that affect how difficult it is to implement certain things on PC vs console?

I assume some differences are

  • for console, you only need to cater for one 'spec' or resolution whereas PC needs to handle multiple resolutions

  • PS/Xbox will have certain UI specifics/API you need to adhere to

  • different control schemes so that will affect UI design

While both PC and console UI go through our Scaleform engine, they were built very differently. It's honestly harder for me to talk about the design decisions that went into the PC version, because I wasn't here when they were made. I do know that the PC's UI does some things in a very funky way. Even something as basic as input handling on the PC is done in a way that I would not expect. When we started working on the console UI we had an opportunity to get a fresh start and get the UI to behave in a way we expected it to.

Because of this, we definitely had a lot of discussion about doing a "reverse port" back to PC, as you guys put it. After all, if we finally got the UI working the way we thought it should have all this time, then why not bring that awesomeness to the PC as well? There are some complications there that we run into. For example (and this is just one of many examples I could give), the console UI doesn't need to support a mouse, but it would really suck if we ported the console UI back over and all of a sudden you could only navigate the UI and all the menus with hotkeys and arrow keys which simulate controller input. We'd want to add mouse support, but then that means all of the buttons on the UI need to actually work like "buttons" and respond to clicks and hovers and all that. Right now they don't (they're just static images), because we didn't need that functionality. So it'd be quite a bit of work to get the console UI to work on the PC, and that's not even getting into discussions about whether or not the designs even feel right for PC players (see my earlier post about how you'd lose certain advantages on PC like having multiple panels up at once).

Again, I'm not saying it won't be done. I'm not sure we have even decided what we want to do yet. We just have a lot to think about.

Thanks for the detail response. I totally understand some things that would not translate over well. Generally console UI is a lot bigger and simplified because players are sitting further away from their Screens. For PCs, you can cram in much more information simply because players are close to their screen and can see much more details.

But I think the core things from the Console that PC players would like is roster, costume closet and highlighting of skills for talents.

Location dAPosts: 1,329 Fantastic

Didn't read because I don't care about the console stuff, but you get an awesome because the gif :D

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